‘As we grow - minimise the rules!’ by Lokeshvara

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‘As we grow - minimise the rules!’ by Lokeshvara

On Tue, 22 August, 2017 - 16:19

upekshapriya

A talk given to conclude the Triratna Buddhist Order Combined UK & Ireland Area Order Weekend held at Adhisthana, 20 August 2017.  

The theme of the weekend was “A rich and many-splendoured thing - valuing the contribution of every Order member”. There were three elements to the theme:

1. Extending outwards
2. Going deeper
3. Learning from the past

Tags:

Combined UK & Ireland Area Order weekend, Triratna order weekend, controversy

Responses

upekshapriya — Tue, 22 Aug, 2017 - 16:20

Audio available at https://www.freebuddhistaudio.com/audio/details.php?num=LOC3184 - you need to be logged in as an Order member to listen to this.

*Updated* The talk will shortly be available for all listeners at the above link.

sudaya — Wed, 23 Aug, 2017 - 08:13

no talk found

Sorry, but no talk was found. Please try again.

???

upekshapriya — Wed, 23 Aug, 2017 - 12:11

That’s because you need to be logged in to FBA as an Order member :)

Centre Team — Thu, 24 Aug, 2017 - 14:56

Hi Sudaya - sorry about that supremely unhelpful site message at Free Buddhist Audio on arriving at a page that requires Order login. I’ve asked the team to change it! Please log in with the same account details you use on The Buddhist Centre Online here: www.freebuddhistaudio.com/order

with metta,

Candradasa

vajrapriya — Tue, 22 Aug, 2017 - 16:27

Thanks for getting this significant talk posted so quickly.

Vaddhaka — Tue, 22 Aug, 2017 - 18:52

Thank you Lokeshvara for a thoughtful and inspiring talk, and thank you Upekshapriya for posting so quickly after the weekend. Vaddhaka

Shakyapada — Tue, 22 Aug, 2017 - 20:44

Thank you so much for what you said Lokesvara, for me your talk was so powerful, so full of integrity. Straight talking from my the heart. It felt like a breath of fresh air amid the confusion of the last eight months and I left on Sunday feeling inspired, full of hope and so pleased and privileged to be part of this very special Order.

danavira — Tue, 22 Aug, 2017 - 23:41

I am left wondering what the reasons for any ‘split’ could be? From what you say, for example, you would be happy if the Order in India decided to split from the Order in the rest of the world? And would help facilitate this kind of split? Is that the kind of thing you might mean? I ask the question but my assumption is that this is not really what you mean. Perhaps you could take the time to write a little here on the kind of split you alluded to in your talk? It is a Pandora’s Box right enough, but you brought it up.

I am of course familiar with what you laid out about our ‘work’. In listening to the talk I would say to you to get out of the institutions as soon as you can. Institutions colonise ‘souls’. I think there is nothing to be done about it, except perhaps to get in, do the job for a time and then get out. But in Adhistana you are surrounded by career Buddhists, successful institutional lives, you probably never stood a chance. All your time spent with fervent believers in our ‘work’ and what we give, and what we bring etc. etc. What if many of your associates are misguided, and living in a dream? Not even their own dream. All the while aging. I suspect, that when it comes right down to it, you will find, it has to be the ‘believers’ way, or the highway. If so I am no longer with you on this basis anymore.

Is this split you mean?

Danavira

akasajoti — Wed, 23 Aug, 2017 - 19:56

Danavira, that’s a broad-brush stroke you paint about those of us living at Adhisthana. I do resonate with the danger in living in what you name a dream-state and giving up your individuality to a group, which is I assume what you’re referring to when you say institutions colonise souls, and this area of practice and responsibility matters to me so I wanted to respond. What you say here makes an assumption about the 23 people living here, the number of whom you know, I guess, is few - let alone those who you know well, or have taken time to understand their inner lives and motivations, or know in the present rather than just historically.

This kind of assumption is an expression of the group-think you so often critique, in that it separates ‘you’ from ‘me’, or ‘you’ from ‘us’, without any attempt at true understanding of each of us as individuals.

I aspire and make every effort in my life to keep my soul alive, more or less successfully at different times in different conditions, and there are ways in which living at Adhisthana contributes deeply to the thriving and individuality of my soul as no doubt there are ways in which it can become less vivid and present to me here - it’s life ebbs and flows in mutual dependence on myself and this place in which I live - this is my practice, and it will be my practice in whatever conditions I choose to live in along the way.

There is a community of rich and varied souls living here, and I don’t recognise your caricature - I witness and trust the integrity, individuality and practice of my friends and fellow community members.

I look forward to meeting you here in a couple of weeks time.